Week 12 Discussion

[Guest]

Good news we won, Bad news I had to check the score from my ER bed. Just got home had a bad Gallbladder attack. Gotta schedule to have it cut out now.

Well, you're welcome for the win then. ;)

Feel better!

[Isacco]

Well imported next file and off to hospital again. Surgery is coming in morning.

Good luck Tom!!!!

[Guest]

I'll put my offensive gameplan out there if people want to see it. It's not like it's a big secret at this point. I don't know how the league feels about gameplan sharing, but if it keeps people from quitting due to frustration in their offensive production, I'll be happy to let you peek behind the curtain of the Boston machine ;)

Directionally i agree but i dont think "throwing deep" is the end all be all of this game.. Here's my 2cents on building a winning program in FOF.

At highest level its a resource optimization game.. so i would break apart the GM and GP part of the game..

On the GM part of the game.. you have to have a system to evaluate your team. This system give you a direction in the offseason to use your resources (draft pick, players) to improve your team. Then you need the ability and discipline to evaluate and acquire the talent.

If i look at my team BKL this year.. I look at the team this way:

We are 7-4
Lost to BOS twice (35-32, 34-33), CHA (30-27), SMD (23-22)

We are 2nd (29.3) in points per game.. good!
We are 2nd (66.2%) in completion %, 6th (7.78) in YPT, 3rd (18.2%) in opp pass rush.. good!
we are 20th in YPC (4.01) but 9th (34.6) in Block %... Oline seems good. We need a better RB
We are 30th in turnovers.. too many turnovers.

OFFENSE EVALUATION: We have a very good offense, if we can get a quality RB and turnover the ball less we will have a dominating offense... overall we look good on offense.

On D:

We are 20th (21.0) in points allowed.. NOT GOOD!
We are 8th in pass rush %... good
We are 19th in pass defense %... not good
We are 20th in opp completion %.. not good
We are 10th in opp turnovers.. 3rd in INTs.. good our D can get turnovers
We are 31th (32) in pass defends.. SUPER SUCKY!

DEFENSE EVALUATION: Need to improve our pass D

I would go into the offseason looking to improve my running game and my pass D.. looking to upgrade my RB or CB/FS.

Draft time i would look at NEED (RB, PassD) or BPA

I just do this every year.

In general i agree with bars that mike and nutah focuses on (big play WR, pass blocking Oline, pass rushing Dline, great 2ndary)..

In general, you need a mix of studs ( guys that can do it all at their position) and role players (1 bar specialist.. pass blocking Oline, pass rushing Dline, INT CB/FSs).

I tend to use my 1st and 2nd round picks on studs and rest of picks on role players .

On the GP part of the game.. once i feel you have talent there are many ways to slice the cow.. for example, BKL we are mostly a short passing team with 70% completion % for most of the year and 2nd currently in scoring. I try to throw deep but i couldnt because of crappy cohesion, crappy running game, crappy oline so i just went with short passing.. even in short passing you still need pass blocking and you still need great WR to break big plays.

Nutah i feel is the best at evaluating, acquiring, and utilizing high impact talent.. for example he was able to acquire WR Bob Hansen last year at 1.7.. it would be great if you guys can talk about the philosophy of team building in additional to GPing.

You still need alot of luck to win championships.. thats what makes NUTAH's run soo crazy amazing... but we at BKL are trying our best to stop that run.

Thats my 2 cents.. not sure if its useful.

[Guest]

im with bomber on this you cant just put talent together and hope it works even with my 2 wr last year i only finished 9-7 and still couldn't beat Utah i did some minor tweaks, got some affinities for my qb and really nailed down my gameplanning, still working on it, the obvious measuring stick is beating a 100% utah.

but i do think bombers "holistic" approach is the way to go

[Aston]

Not to oversimplify, but I think this game, as in real life football, boils down to two things: a) rushing the passer, and b) stopping the pass rush.

As I said before, devoting even a single of the 5 OL or 4 DL spots to someone who can't pass rush is sacrificing either (a) or (b) with no way of making it up. So ignore these at your own peril.

Many teams get the weapons at WR or QB or CB but haven't tended to one or both of these. But you still need to win the trenches first. Importantly, note that this isn't about draft strategy. WRs and CBs are hard to get early, while OL pass blockers can be had much later.

I do think throwing deep is a dominant strategy, though. Team management is open ended, so you could employ anything as a strategy. Some are better than others. In the NFL, the dominant strategy is luck or draft your way into a Tom Brady caliber QB and have the best coaches. In FOF, at least currently, it's being better at stretching the field than the other guy. In both cases most teams can't, so it's interesting to see what teams do when they're in that position.

Fortunately, it's a lot easier to develop the long passing game in FOF than it is to get Brady/Belicheck or equivalent in the NFL. So, for all the complaints about various stats like pass yards per attempt being slightly different from the real NFL, the pathway to become competitive is less tough, and a lot less arbitrary. Kudos to mike for his efforts at detailing how.

[Guest]

Nutah.. let me ask you a simple question..

if you were just joining OSFL and you had to win a championship in 6 years or you get your fingers chop off (just saying... so it create urgency) and you had to compete with yourself, and your team is like the BKL team i took over. what would be the steps to maximize your odds of winning a championship in 6 years? year1? year2? year3?

also, what do you think are the odds of a team that takes your recommended approach can beat your current UTAH team given what you do year in and year out?

[Aston]

I would pore over the change trackers, win as many trades as I can in outlandish fashion, get some extra draft currency and use them.

Or like what Brooklyn's done :)

I think it'll be pretty tough, because the Bees have such a good pass rush and also a very good line. If you have both of those and the weapons it's just really hard to stop. And Utah hasn't been stopped too much lately. Although certainly you could get even better receivers than Utah has -- we just have Hansen and some solid guys, not Liening/Morrison like Phoenix.

I mean, of course nothing's that straightforward, but I think it's the general gameplan, and then it's up to how you execute it / dice.

[Guest]

I would pore over the change trackers, win as many trades as I can in outlandish fashion, get some extra draft currency and use them.

Or like what Brooklyn's done :)

So I feel THATS the hard part of the game.. not the game planning..

for example, you dont make mistakes at all, you recycles and optimize your resources extremely well... and you are aggressive when need to be (like getting your WRs in both CFL and Hansen in OSFL, your pass blocking RT and OG in CFL who are the best pass blockers in CFL)..and you work hard (you move back and forth in the draft, you keep all the change trackers and reviews them), and you are smart as heck!

So thats the competition!

Then i have to deal with Mike and BOS.. great!

I think it'll be pretty tough, because the Bees have such a good pass rush and also a very good line.

I mean, of course nothing's that straightforward, but I think it's the general gameplan, and then it's up to how you execute it / dice.

It is super tough. and its super tight.. vs MIKE last 3 games we lost all of them by 3 points or less... so I am thinking i need a better Punter and better FB then him at this point and just in general more depth across the board..

So at the highest level, i think to beat you or mike, you need to be extremely smart, extremely lucky, and extremely patient.. all 3 will give you a decent chance in the long run. having 2.. i think you will still get your ass kick..

fair?

[Aston]

I think there's a lot to share about things like what you look for in a player, how to scout draft prospects and figure out how good they are, and how to gameplan. The 'how the game works' side of things should be laid on the table but it isn't always, or at least everyone has different ideas here and there and the most veteran players can give some bad advice (unintentionally, hopefully).

After that, yeah, it's about your approach to managing the team and that's a whole lot of luck. Effort's in there too, but as long as everyone knows how the game works, the playing field is appropriately even, right? Your CyFL Bears would be in such better shape without those devastating VSOD hits.

[Guest]

Nutah is amazing at evaluation of players in the draft and gameplanning. He drafts REALLY well, and it's perhaps his best asset as a GM, but he also gameplans very well. Nutah trades well, which is much focused on by the people of the OSFL. It's much scrutinized, (PUPPIES) but the reason he's been so dominant is drafting and gameplanning. If you want to get more meta: he understands what's important in players at each position, and his gameplan is crafted to cater to the strengths of his players.

I feel like I've put together a starting player roster that's better than Nutah's this season, but he's played most of it with a backup quarterback and I haven't. Guess who has the better record?!?!

If you look at Nutah's roster year by year, you'll see that his roster isn't THAT impressive (albeit still pretty good) based on playing ratings, but all his players have "bars in the right places" and his gameplans are created masterfully. The teams also tend to be very deep based on his drafting skill, so if he loses someone to injury it isn't as big a deal.

I've had God knows how many seasons in FOFL with two STUD receivers and a really good WR3 and decent supporting talent. The results? 3 conference championship losses and a bowl loss. Nutah drafts and gameplans like a champ, and he has the E-Trophies to prove it.

Is it best to chuck the ball deep to guys with BPR? Fuck yeah, it is, but the Bees definitely have not lived and died by that principle over this era of stinging-Bee dominance. I only wish Mike didn't beat me in the championship last season so I could take a swing at it, even if it turned out to bee futile!

Oh yeah, and the three "C"'s, as Ben would have it: Chemistry, Cohesion, and Coaching. I'm probably a little crazier on chemistry than Nutah, but he touches on it too. And when you draft well...your cohesion tends to be pretty good with guys stepping in after being prime backups for years.

[Guest]

I only wish Mike didn't beat me in the championship last season so I could take a swing at it, even if it turned out to bee futile!

hhahhaah... stinging-Bee dominance...bee futile... pretty funny foos!

[Guest]

Hey NUTAH... i am really liking this league. thanks for inviting me to join. Hopefully i am adding something to this place.

[Aston]

Oh, glad you're here bomber. It's fun tell your friends!

Utah's had a stranglehold on the 100 roster rating here since 2022, when we traded for Giang, I believe. I think a lot of my players don't look that impressive at a glance, but I think probably 85% of the team are creepers, whereas teams with a lot of droppers probably look a little better than they really are.

[Guest]

Oh, glad you're here bomber. It's fun tell your friends!

Utah's had a stranglehold on the 100 roster rating here since 2022, when we traded for Giang, I believe. I think a lot of my players don't look that impressive at a glance, but I think probably 85% of the team are creepers, whereas teams with a lot of droppers probably look a little better than they really are.

This is true, but I am a team of talented players with a bad owner, with some exceptions like Ted Pleasant, who despite his VSOL, is probably still dropping a bit.

[Guest]

hhahhaah... stinging-Bee dominance...bee futile... pretty funny foos!

I haz a weakness for puns.