Draft 2029 Class Discussion

[Aston]

SCREEN PASSES!

[Clay]

I'll move 1.7 for the right offer.

[Isacco]

I like the fact that all the great "guru-Buddha-legendary-Confucio" GMs (here and in other leagues I'm in) are against Ben and his theory (about the WRs and the BPR) before the draft start.
I always hear comments like: "You have been listening Ben and FOFC too much", "WRs are over hyped now", "I do think Ben and FOFC have played a big role in the WRs and BPR obsession", "BPR is overrated", "Ben want that you concentrate on WRs so he can take the best C at 1.32", "The best value pick of the draft is my DE. I was able to take this great player at 1.32 because all of you went behind mediocre WRs with the high picks", etc.
But after the draft is underway the same GMs are ready to trade all their picks (past, present & future) to take one.
I see some GMs win without great WRs (it's rare but it's possible) but it's true that you have more possibilities to be successfull if you have a great WRs duo in your team. So why we refuse to admit that WRs are the most important players in the game?
Sorry I'm thinking aloud ...

[Guest]

I am sad that I am not a guru-Buddha-legendary-Confucio GM :(

[Sharkn20]

I think the same like you... Simply see the last years finalists... Have a good overall team without elite WRs... The season is so long and you need to compensate your team, also can think in the cap situation... With a stud WR, WR, QB your cap will be in jeopardy... So maybe you have one or two years to win it all and start again... I believe in a few studs all over the team and a good players in the other positions... I'm trying to do that since I arrive here and have only one season behind 9 victories in 4 years...

[Aston]

There's no question that WRs are the most important in the game.

I think they're only overrated in the sense that WR/BPR obsession often leads to teams throwing their picks - high or low in the first round or later - at bad or average WRs.

Teams shouldn't do that and that kind of reaching on WRs (and especially QBs, where it's much easier to get a totally useless guy if you're not careful) is what lets perennial playoff teams sometimes land 80-rated players in the bottom of round 1. That's what I'm always on about as far as "Ben stuff" goes. WRs being important means true stud WRs are important, not draft the 40-rated guy with 60 BPR at 1.20 instead of the best center or guard you've ever seen.

Once you're talking about that 70-rated WR with 80 BPR, though, unless you have like two or three of those guys, why draft anything else? You can get a safety, LB, or whatever else at the top of the draft but you can get slightly lesser ones later and be OK with it. It's very hard to be OK with the next tier of WRs, unless your entire team is great. And it is simply rare to be able to get a guy like that.

The only thing that would make a good argument, I think, is a monster, perfect DE who can pass rush like a maniac. This is the kind of player that causes so many incompletions it can negate the passing games of a lot of teams. But you sort of need a good set of 4 pass rushers to accomplish that. I do believe personally this game is primarily about protecting your passer, and not letting the other team protect theirs.

As for the other WR traded for early, I have some doubts about him being worth it. His BPR would need to be pretty high, which it might not be. Hansen, though, I had pegged as a 1.2 as soon as I interviewed him. Maybe there are some slight ?s but not much.

[Guest]

No questions on Hansen from this guy. IMO he should've went 1.2. I didn't think he'd drop.

[Guest]

There's no question that WRs are the most important in the game.

I think they're only overrated in the sense that WR/BPR obsession often leads to teams throwing their picks - high or low in the first round or later - at bad or average WRs.

Teams shouldn't do that and that kind of reaching on WRs (and especially QBs, where it's much easier to get a totally useless guy if you're not careful) is what lets perennial playoff teams sometimes land 80-rated players in the bottom of round 1. That's what I'm always on about as far as "Ben stuff" goes. WRs being important means true stud WRs are important, not draft the 40-rated guy with 60 BPR at 1.20 instead of the best center or guard you've ever seen.

Once you're talking about that 70-rated WR with 80 BPR, though, unless you have like two or three of those guys, why draft anything else? You can get a safety, LB, or whatever else at the top of the draft but you can get slightly lesser ones later and be OK with it. It's very hard to be OK with the next tier of WRs, unless your entire team is great. And it is simply rare to be able to get a guy like that.

The only thing that would make a good argument, I think, is a monster, perfect DE who can pass rush like a maniac. This is the kind of player that causes so many incompletions it can negate the passing games of a lot of teams. But you sort of need a good set of 4 pass rushers to accomplish that. I do believe personally this game is primarily about protecting your passer, and not letting the other team protect theirs.

da TROOF

[Sharkn20]

I really doubt between Lustz and Hansen but the lack of QB cost us a play off apparition last year, despite he played decent... So maybe the next year I can't be in disposition to trade up for another stud WR but I will have QB the next 15 years I expect...

[Isacco]

There's no question that WRs are the most important in the game.

I think they're only overrated in the sense that WR/BPR obsession often leads to teams throwing their picks - high or low in the first round or later - at bad or average WRs.

Teams shouldn't do that and that kind of reaching on WRs (and especially QBs, where it's much easier to get a totally useless guy if you're not careful) is what lets perennial playoff teams sometimes land 80-rated players in the bottom of round 1. That's what I'm always on about as far as "Ben stuff" goes. WRs being important means true stud WRs are important, not draft the 40-rated guy with 60 BPR at 1.20 instead of the best center or guard you've ever seen.

Once you're talking about that 70-rated WR with 80 BPR, though, unless you have like two or three of those guys, why draft anything else? You can get a safety, LB, or whatever else at the top of the draft but you can get slightly lesser ones later and be OK with it. It's very hard to be OK with the next tier of WRs, unless your entire team is great. And it is simply rare to be able to get a guy like that.

The only thing that would make a good argument, I think, is a monster, perfect DE who can pass rush like a maniac. This is the kind of player that causes so many incompletions it can negate the passing games of a lot of teams. But you sort of need a good set of 4 pass rushers to accomplish that. I do believe personally this game is primarily about protecting your passer, and not letting the other team protect theirs.

As for the other WR traded for early, I have some doubts about him being worth it. His BPR would need to be pretty high, which it might not be. Hansen, though, I had pegged as a 1.2 as soon as I interviewed him. Maybe there are some slight ?s but not much.

So, in summary, there are two options for the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha GM:
1. If he is able to trade up (with the "3 x 1.32" typical offer that no one is able to refuse because all GMs are "under a spell" when the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha ask to trade) to take a WR with great BPR, etc. his comment post-draft are: "BPR is the bar to win all", "WR is the only position who count", "Why you take a QB/CB/S/DE/DT/T when you need only a WR to win?", etc. And all applaud the guru for this. Now all of us know we need to draft a WR to be successfull: the discovery of the Holy Grail.
2. If he is not able to trade up to take the great WR he is forced to take a Center with his "mediocre" 1.32. In this case his comment post-draft are: "Thanks a lot to give me the possibility to take the 90 rating Center", "Why all of you went behind this mediocre WRs when all you need is a good Center to win?", etc. And all applaude the guru because no one of us knows that the center is the most important position in a football team because they give the ball to the quarterback.

[Guest]

In summary, Isacco doesn't like the idea of FOF "experts".

[Guest]

I really doubt between Lustz and Hansen but the lack of QB cost us a play off apparition last year, despite he played decent... So maybe the next year I can't be in disposition to trade up for another stud WR but I will have QB the next 15 years I expect...

I can understand taking Lustz. God knows I've found out where mediocre QBs get you the past few years....I just was lukewarm for Lustz and loved Hansen.

[Aston]

So, in summary, there are two options for the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha GM:
1. If he is able to trade up (with the "3 x 1.32" typical offer that no one is able to refuse because all GMs are "under a spell" when the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha ask to trade) to take a WR with great BPR, etc. his comment post-draft are: "BPR is the bar to win all", "WR is the only position who count", "Why you take a QB/CB/S/DE/DT/T when you need only a WR to win?", etc. And all applaud the guru for this. Now all of us know we need to draft a WR to be successfull: the discovery of the Holy Grail.
2. If he is not able to trade up to take the great WR he is forced to take a Center with his "mediocre" 1.32. In this case his comment post-draft are: "Thanks a lot to give me the possibility to take the 90 rating Center", "Why all of you went behind this mediocre WRs when all you need is a good Center to win?", etc. And all applaude the guru because no one of us knows that the center is the most important position in a football team because they give the ball to the quarterback.

That's not really it at all, but take whatever conclusions you like. Your mileage and opinions may vary of course.

You pointed out - correctly - that the stud WR is super important and it should be acknowledged. And you asked why I'd comment on the WR craze that takes over Ben leagues (since I do), and I gave my reasoning: because the stud WR is super important, but the average WR isn't.

I'm not a guru though, just a guy with opinions, which people regularly disagree with. I'm sure Ben would say something like there are no WRs worth a damn after round 1 in his leagues yadda yadda so people have to draft those other guys, and while I'm skeptical, I've also never really played those leagues.

Also, getting even an elite WR clearly isn't the ticket to winning, but it's a better place to start than most other things, IMO, just because the opportunity is so rare.

In this year's case I don't think it was anything other than Hansen really flew under the radar by appearing so far down the list and it didn't appear anyone really had him in his sights. If he looked more like Glynn I'm sure he would have gone #2. I'm just happy that he did fall a little bit; maybe deserved, maybe not, and we'll see.

He's definitely not on Glynn's level but he should be good enough for me. I went crazy for him because I'm tired of having so many picks anyway, and a new WR is pretty much just what the doctor ordered for this team. It's not like I ran out of stock either [three 2s next year and two 1s the year after], so I'm definitely not saying "Guys, you should trade like I did when you see a WR." Use whatever draft strategy you like

[Guest]

So, in summary, there are two options for the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha GM:
1. If he is able to trade up (with the "3 x 1.32" typical offer that no one is able to refuse because all GMs are "under a spell" when the guru-Confucio-legendary-Buddha ask to trade) to take a WR with great BPR, etc. his comment post-draft are: "BPR is the bar to win all", "WR is the only position who count", "Why you take a QB/CB/S/DE/DT/T when you need only a WR to win?", etc. And all applaud the guru for this. Now all of us know we need to draft a WR to be successfull: the discovery of the Holy Grail.
2. If he is not able to trade up to take the great WR he is forced to take a Center with his "mediocre" 1.32. In this case his comment post-draft are: "Thanks a lot to give me the possibility to take the 90 rating Center", "Why all of you went behind this mediocre WRs when all you need is a good Center to win?", etc. And all applaude the guru because no one of us knows that the center is the most important position in a football team because they give the ball to the quarterback.

QFT

[Sharkn20]

Only 2 days until the draft starts!!