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**BradleyB** · 02-04-2009, 12:20 PM

i thought money over 20 mil was wiped out...not auto contributed to the stadium fund..

**mahoney2** · 02-04-2009, 12:24 PM

I like where you're going with this, i'm swamped at work right now but i'll reply later...

Wasn't the $20mm cap done with the intent on taking some cash out of the game and not screwing smaller market teams?

**Clay** · 02-04-2009, 12:24 PM

Money over $20,000,000 in CASH is auto contributed to the Stadium Fund.... however, the cap on the Stadium Fund is also $20,000,000.... so if you have $20.0 in the stadium fund... then yes... it's wiped out.

**Clay** · 02-04-2009, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by mahoney2 View Post

I like where you're going with this, i'm swamped at work right now but i'll reply later...

Wasn't the $20mm cap done with the intent on taking some cash out of the game and not screwing smaller market teams?

In the discussions that Andrew and I had, we actually feel like a rule like this could help the smaller market teams more than the large market teams because it presents the opportunity to hang onto some of their players through smart finances.

However, this is where you all come in... shoot holes in it. What would work... what doesn't.... how could it be exploited.... is it realistic....

I know just looking at this season... it's almost all medium to small market teams affected.

EDIT: And the largest market team that did have any money... was Dallas ($325,000) and it was due largely to the fact that he wrote articles... something that should be rewarded.

**Andrew** · 02-04-2009, 12:30 PM

No, all cash over $20m is wiped out at the end of the season. The only thing auto contributed to the stadium fund is bonuses (awards, articles, etc) and money received in luxury tax over $20 million. This happens after the cash max is applied.. I don't think we have a cap on the stadium fund.

I'm definitely in favor of making some modifications here and giving people more things to do with the extra cash. I'm looking at some other leagues and have found some pretty cool ideas.

My biggest concern, which I mentioned to Clay, is that the BLB is creating too many custom rules. Financials in this game are already difficult for new owners to understand so adding another layer might make it overly complex.

**Riverman** · 02-04-2009, 01:13 PM

I think it would be interesting to add some new things that can be done with cash, especially if we don't have to think them up ourselves.

This particular suggestion doesn't seem like it would be much different than simply increasing the cash maximum for teams who are over $20 million after recieving bonuses, awards, etc though.

**Ryan** · 02-04-2009, 02:08 PM

I like whats been presented.

My only thought would be to allow teams to horde their cash in a bank to use it towards resigning a guy or going hard in FA, but that may bring problems we don't want.

Maybe instead of a use it or lose it thing for that season, let them save it for a period of years (2-4?) then use it for resigning guys. This seems like it would've helped Jistic out when he could'nt re-up his guys.

Just some thoughts.

**Jim** · 02-04-2009, 02:35 PM

Sounds like more work for Andrew and it seems like the times when a sim runs late (other than when Andrew's out of town) is because there's a bunch of manual stuff Andrew has to do...trades, draft, take people off DL and insert in line-ups, etc.

Plus, I'm more for punishing the teams who overspend vs. rewarding the ones who are frugal with their money. I like the new rules where teams are fined for going in the red & overspending in consecutive years. I'd also be for more stuff involving luxury tax. It would be work for Andrew but it would be a one time adjustment only for the teams that are penalized vs. this idea where Andrew would have to go in and adjust all these contracts.

**Riverman** · 02-04-2009, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by chippered View Post

I like whats been presented.

My only thought would be to allow teams to horde their cash in a bank to use it towards resigning a guy or going hard in FA, but that may bring problems we don't want.

Maybe instead of a use it or lose it thing for that season, let them save it for a period of years (2-4?) then use it for resigning guys. This seems like it would've helped Jistic out when he could'nt re-up his guys.

Just some thoughts.

I don't think there is any difference between using the extra cash to reduce future contracts or simply adding it to the cash balance. Either way, the team will have extra cash for resinging guys or pursuing FAs.

What I don't understand is why it is suggested that earning extra cash through, say, one's league winning the All Star game is more virtuous than earning it with a team that plays well, draws well and makes the playoffs. As I understand the proposal, the cash from the former over $20 million can be used to reduce future salaries, while the cash from the latter over $20 million is simply lost as now.

**Clay** · 02-04-2009, 03:25 PM

Originally posted by Jim View Post

Sounds like more work for Andrew and it seems like the times when a sim runs late (other than when Andrew's out of town) is because there's a bunch of manual stuff Andrew has to do...trades, draft, take people off DL and insert in line-ups, etc.

That's valid, but that was accounted for. We specifically said that this would be limited to 1 or 2 sims per season. Perhaps like the period right now between financials being finalized and FA beginning.

**Jim** · 02-04-2009, 05:58 PM

Yeah but 1 or 2 sims & possibly a bunch of players. That could be a tedious process and could take some time.

**Whale** · 02-04-2009, 06:40 PM

Wait.... I just lost $4.6m? D'oh....

**Andrew** · 02-05-2009, 09:51 AM

Here are some ideas I've found from other leagues. Most league's do this in terms of "participation points" but we could create a system that uses cash as well.

I also agree with what Riverman said. Why is one type of cash more virtuous than others? I think it might be a good idea to allow teams to keep any bonus money over the cash max as cash, rather than automatically convert it to the stadium fund. The catch to that is, if you choose to leave it as cash it will be subject to the cash max at the end of the following season.

- edit player intangibles (work ethic, greed, etc)
- stadium expansion and alteration (already doing this)
- change logo
- change team nickname
- change fan loyalty/market size
- convert to usable cash
- add nickname to player
- improve personnel
- convert retired player to personnel
- teach players new positions
- modify pitcher endurance
- buy down injury time for injuries longer than 6 months
- offer bonuses to talk a player out of retirement.

And my favorite idea.. I saw a basic version of this and decided to expand a little bit...
- a system for stadium maintenance and renovation. Basically each stadium would start to decay over time. We would probably make it a static amount each year * a small random number so we would have a little bit of variance.
- Teams could spend money on yearly maintenance costs to slow the decay
- Teams could instead save money and perform renovation which would cost signficantly more.
- Teams could also save money and use the system (which probably needs to be revised) to build a new stadium.

Why would teams want to waste money on this?
- Because after a stadium reaches a certain level of decay Fan Interest and Fan Loyalty starts to drop, which of course effects attendance, etc.
- Teams with high quality stadiums and new stadiums will get bonuses to Fan Interest and Fan Loyalty.

**Plastic** · 02-05-2009, 10:31 AM

Originally posted by Andrew View Post

Here are some ideas I've found from other leagues. Most league's do this in terms of "participation points" but we could create a system that uses cash as well.

I also agree with what Riverman said. Why is one type of cash more virtuous than others? I think it might be a good idea to allow teams to keep any bonus money over the cash max as cash, rather than automatically convert it to the stadium fund. The catch to that is, if you choose to leave it as cash it will be subject to the cash max at the end of the following season.

- edit player intangibles (work ethic, greed, etc)
- stadium expansion and alteration (already doing this)
- change logo
- change team nickname
- change fan loyalty/market size
- convert to usable cash
- add nickname to player
- improve personnel
- convert retired player to personnel
- teach players new positions
- modify pitcher endurance
- buy down injury time for injuries longer than 6 months
- offer bonuses to talk a player out of retirement.

And my favorite idea.. I saw a basic version of this and decided to expand a little bit...
- a system for stadium maintenance and renovation. Basically each stadium would start to decay over time. We would probably make it a static amount each year * a small random number so we would have a little bit of variance.
- Teams could spend money on yearly maintenance costs to slow the decay
- Teams could instead save money and perform renovation which would cost signficantly more.
- Teams could also save money and use the system (which probably needs to be revised) to build a new stadium.

Why would teams want to waste money on this?
- Because after a stadium reaches a certain level of decay Fan Interest and Fan Loyalty starts to drop, which of course effects attendance, etc.
- Teams with high quality stadiums and new stadiums will get bonuses to Fan Interest and Fan Loyalty.

There are alot of good ideas there Andrew. I especially like the Stadium decay idea, that is pretty realistic. And it makes sense that new stadiums and renovations would increase fan interest and loyalty.

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