Class of 1984: Free Agents

[Riverman]

In looking over the upcoming FA class, I noticed several teams have a lot of minor-league FAs. I know Batavia had to do a lot of work to get enough guys signed to fill out his minors. It is important to resign most of your upcoming minor-league FAs if you want to avoid going through the same process next season.

[Clay]

Also, if you are going to bring up Dallas it is pretty hard to understand why you didn't mention Albors (VORP over 30 this season so far) or Sato (2.14 ERA in 63 innings out of the pen). To me, these guys have done their share to make Dallas the team that they are.

To be honest, I didn't even remember Albors and his giant contract and, while many will disagree... while Sato's contribution to his team is great, I think the $8.0+ will be a thing of the past and were never necessary in this league. If there's one thing that you can do in OOTP, it's groom a bullpen from mid to late picks.

And I'm not poo-pooing the value of FAs... hell... I don't have the pitiful wins I do have if I don't spend big on Wilton Harcourt... I just think that if you look at the Champions of the league.... there's not a FA spender in the bunch. Even Washington and their huge budget wasn't made up of big time FA gets.

[Pat]

Even Washington and their huge budget wasn't made up of big time FA gets.

I don't think I had a single FA-get on that entire team.

[Riverman]

To be honest, I didn't even remember Albors and his giant contract and, while many will disagree... while Sato's contribution to his team is great, I think the $8.0+ will be a thing of the past and were never necessary in this league. If there's one thing that you can do in OOTP, it's groom a bullpen from mid to late picks.

And I'm not poo-pooing the value of FAs... hell... I don't have the pitiful wins I do have if I don't spend big on Wilton Harcourt... I just think that if you look at the Champions of the league.... there's not a FA spender in the bunch. Even Washington and their huge budget wasn't made up of big time FA gets.

You are definately right that the teams that have won it all so far have not done it through free agency but I would say it didn't have to be that way. Baltimore in particular had some good teams and a lot of money that they could have spent but didn't. I'll bet that team has lost close to $100 million in revenue sharing and there were players out there that could have helped them. In my first season I signed Lacour and Joyce to big FA contracts and finished just 3 back of WC even though I lost Joyce for the season in his second start. A rotation featuring LaRochelle, Lacour and Joyce all in their primes would have been very dangerous in the playoffs.

But your initial advice was to an expansion team who hopes to improve by signing a couple of guys I doubt that they are expecting to suddenly be a serious threat to go all the way; they just want to win a few more games. Meanwhile they are around $40 million under budget for next year. The last thing I would suggest to them is to sit on that money and allow you and the other big-budget teams to have all the fun during free agency.

[Clay]

You are definately right that the teams that have won it all so far have not done it through free agency but I would say it didn't have to be that way. Baltimore in particular had some good teams and a lot of money that they could have spent but didn't. I'll bet that team has lost close to $100 million in revenue sharing and there were players out there that could have helped them. In my first season I signed Lacour and Joyce to big FA contracts and finished just 3 back of WC even though I lost Joyce for the season in his second start. A rotation featuring LaRochelle, Lacour and Joyce all in their primes would have been very dangerous in the playoffs.

But your initial advice was to an expansion team who hopes to improve by signing a couple of guys I doubt that they are expecting to suddenly be a serious threat to go all the way; they just want to win a few more games. Meanwhile they are around $40 million under budget for next year. The last thing I would suggest to them is to sit on that money and allow you and the other big-budget teams to have all the fun during free agency.

Yes and No... I don't suggest that they sit on their money. I tell everyone they're foolish not to spend at least up to the $20.0 cash limit.... but even an Expansion team CAN improve without FA. High picks and prospects can easily be parlayed into top flight players that will other wise never hit FA. I guess that's more of my point than anything.... the true best of the best... SHOULDN'T hit FA.

[Guest]

I hate FA with a passion, actually. The only guy that I ever spent money on that's turned out good is Sisk. Delosantos, MacKnight, and Dupuis have all sucked.

[Jake]

Obviously just like in real life there's a million ways to skin a cat. You can try to do it through FA, or the draft, or trades, but finding a good balance of all three is going to get you there the fastest.

I do tend to agree with Clay, though. We spent a lot of money this offseason but not really expecting to win right away with it. LaRochelle was a stupid move on my part, IMO. I guess being my first offseason I got a little carried away. But Roger Morgan is going to contribute and be pretty much a perfect fit for me in the OF and at DH for the life of his contract if not longer. If/when I do contend in the next couple years, he'll be a big part. BUT... more importantly, and to support Clay's argument, if/when I do contend, it's going to have A LOT more to do with all the youngsters I've acquired either in rebuilding over the last year or that were in my system when I took over Syracuse than it will with any FA acquistion I make between last season and then. I think another good example is Indy. They made quite a splash in FA last offseason and I don't want to speak for chippered but I think he expected those moves to pay off and to contend in the Pilsner right away. But IMO, when he does contend it'll be when those young guys develop and come through his system, and while the FAs might be a part of the big picture, they won't tell the whole story.

[Riverman]

Obviously just like in real life there's a million ways to skin a cat. You can try to do it through FA, or the draft, or trades, but finding a good balance of all three is going to get you there the fastest.

I do tend to agree with Clay, though. We spent a lot of money this offseason but not really expecting to win right away with it. LaRochelle was a stupid move on my part, IMO. I guess being my first offseason I got a little carried away. But Roger Morgan is going to contribute and be pretty much a perfect fit for me in the OF and at DH for the life of his contract if not longer. If/when I do contend in the next couple years, he'll be a big part. BUT... more importantly, and to support Clay's argument, if/when I do contend, it's going to have A LOT more to do with all the youngsters I've acquired either in rebuilding over the last year or that were in my system when I took over Syracuse than it will with any FA acquistion I make between last season and then. I think another good example is Indy. They made quite a splash in FA last offseason and I don't want to speak for chippered but I think he expected those moves to pay off and to contend in the Pilsner right away. But IMO, when he does contend it'll be when those young guys develop and come through his system, and while the FAs might be a part of the big picture, they won't tell the whole story.

I am not sure how what you wrote supports Clay since - "finding a good balance of all three is going to get you there the fastest" - is precisely what I advocate. I have never argued that making dumb FA signings (as you describe your move for LaRochelle) is the way to go. Exactly the contrary, my view is that it is improtant for an expansion team to make good FA signings if they hope to contend within 5-10 seasons.

[Sully]

Wow....all this on a Saturday? Get out of the house, losers!

[Jim]

I'll agree it's a combo of farm system, FAs & trades. Some key players that have really made my team this year:

Sato: FA
Albors: FA
Lewis: Trade
Murry: Trade
Jorge: Trade
Miller: Trade
Molenza: Farm system
Corona: Farm system
Escoba: FA (minor league FA)
Zimerman: Rule V pick

It hurt to let some guys go, like Alvarez, but I was able to get different pieces to make my team better.

I'm hoping Melgoza can pick it up here at the end of the season & Samarano (off the DL end of Sept) can help out after being on the DL for a year.

[Jake]

I am not sure how what you wrote supports Clay since - "finding a good balance of all three is going to get you there the fastest" - is precisely what I advocate. I have never argued that making dumb FA signings (as you describe your move for LaRochelle) is the way to go. Exactly the contrary, my view is that it is improtant for an expansion team to make good FA signings if they hope to contend within 5-10 seasons.

I guess where I "side" with Clay is that the meat and potatoes of your team has to come from the farm. There's just not enough money in the world to build a core through FA. I don't think anyone's saying not to spend a single penny in FA, just that you can't rely on it to build something of value.

[Clay]

Wow....all this on a Saturday? Get out of the house, losers!

It rained all day here today (Saturday) and the Tiger game wasn't on till 7:05. So, I was updating a website that I maintain for my softball league and did a little posting. Good times.

[Riverman]

Wow....all this on a Saturday? Get out of the house, losers!

Advice from the gentleman with almost 3K posts on this forum.

[Sully]

Advice from the gentleman with almost 3K posts on this forum.

Don't hate because I can post from work.

[Clay]

Don't hate because I can post from work.

Testify, Brother!!!